Maybe the parents didn't pray hard enough, or maybe Jesus was just busy or maybe, just maybe there are no gods and people need to take their kids to the doctor when they get sick and stop relying on 5,000 year old goat herding culture to live their lives.
From the article:
Carl Worthington, 28, and his wife, Raylene, 25, belong to a church that believes in faith healing, and police said that, instead of going to a doctor when their 15-month-old daughter Ava got sick, they turned to prayer.
The infant girl died March 2 from bacterial bronchial pneumonia and an infection, both of which could have been cured with common antibiotics, the medical examiner said.
I completely agree with charging these people with manslaughter. I also think that the people within their church that encouraged this behavior and/or knew what was going on but did nothing should be charged as accessories to murder.
Edit: This isn't the first kid from that church to die because prayer is an epic fail. Here's another.
Edit Edit: Here's a wiki about their church.
Last freaking edit, I swear !!! But I had to say this. I'd make a bet that the fundies will remain mostly silent on this since this shows that when it comes right down to it, their deity and prayer just simply do not work.
Of course you will always have those that say 'Oh, I stubbed my toe and Jesus made it all better!', but when it comes to doing something tangible like actually healing a disease that modern medicine can easily heal, the failure of divinity is obvious.
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But...but...you can't criticize someone for their religion! It's off limits for scrutiny.
ReplyDeleteThis is like the people who say "God will provide all that we need" when something bad happens and aren't proactive, but taken to a higher level. (or a lower one?)
Here is the convo between my gf and I after reading that.
ReplyDeleteGF:so if my church believed in child sacrifice, can i get off the hook too?
i mean that's my beliefs
you have to let me live by my religious beliefs
me: exactly
GF: and you also shouldn't convict any of the Islamic terrorists of terrorism attacks either
me: such bullshit
GF: It's their religious beliefs after all.
You are oppressing them
Well freedom of religion doesn't mean whatever the fuck you want
me: my religion says i need to murder everyone
stop fucking oppressing me!!!
Beam,
ReplyDeleteThat convo nails it. To sanction this sort of behavior is to give people carte blanche to murder their kids.
...and there was another one of a girl who died of diabetes because their parents chose prayer instead of insulin. (no time to find a link at the moment, sorry)
ReplyDeleteIt's bad enough that you can't force parents to vaccinate their kids against measles, but to refuse possible treatment in an emergency case is just disgusting (and gives me the feeling that I should learn more English cuss words)
There was also a comment on one of those news articles that God does heal people but he uses other to make it happen. So God is using doctors as a tool to heal. Total cop out.
ReplyDeleteYaeger,
ReplyDeleteAbsolutely it's a cop out. If their god were so powerful he wouldn't need to use other people or tools to heal anyone.
"Absolutely it's a cop out. If their god were so powerful he wouldn't need to use other people or tools to heal anyone."
ReplyDeleteDoes Mark W Laine count as 'other people' or one of the 'tools'?
Wasn't there also a woman who drowned her kids to save them from the devil recently?
Matt,
ReplyDeleteWell he certainly counts as a tool.
I think you're thinking of Andrea Yates.
Oh, but she wasn't a 'real xian'. Benjamin the Sower (Benny the Blower) tried that line of crap on me over at the Swamp way back when as a way to dismiss her behavior as not being associated with what a 'real xian' would do.
Tilia: The case to which you refer is of Madeline Kara Neumann, in which the parents are currently being tried for 2nd degree reckless homicide (for denying the deceased 11-year-old an insulin shot, for her completely treatable Type-I diabetes).
ReplyDeleteLinks:
Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel
Wausau Daily Herald
ABC News
The Northwestern -- this link gives the most recent developments.
Parenting is a privilege, not a right. The state (read: the people) has an obligation to protect its minor citizenry from irresponsible parenting -- up to and including proscribing medical care irrespective of the parents' wishes (even if the child has been so indoctrinated that she agrees with the parents).
There should be a compulsory demonstration of ability in order to retain parental "rights".
--
Stan
(Word Verification: reverses)
Charge Jesus as an accessory to murder and put him on trial... or sue Jesus for malpractice.
ReplyDeleteI think either is a wonderful option.
That's my husband up there, btw. (Thought Minion)
ReplyDelete"That's my husband up there, btw. (Thought Minion)"
ReplyDeleteAnd his first post was priceless.
A big welcome to Thought Minion!
Hey welcome NM's slave, uhm I mean husband. :)
ReplyDeleteThat was a good post.
Have you seen Ray's latest effort with the video of the chip pan fire?
ReplyDeleteSeriously what the fuck is going on in that man's head? Has he started new meds that he's not used to or has he stopped taking the meds he's normally on. That blog of his has gone to shit. The last 5, 6 posts have been beyond the pale.
Oh, it's a chip pan fire. I can't get the video to work and can't access Youtube at work (the horror!)
ReplyDeleteHis post makes a little bit more sense then....not a lot....in fact ....what?
Yeah, he's lost it.
I'm thinking that the fire video is just his way of saying,
ReplyDelete"oh, you silly atheists... it was so obvious that I was doing parody when I referenced the theory of relativity... moral relativity! Hah! You guys just didn't get my awesome joke, so now I'm going to do a parody of your reaction!"
There are numerous reasons why it isn't analogous... shocker, I know.
There must be something in the human brain that controls ones ability to formulate and recognize parodies/analogies/metaphors/abstract thought etc..
ReplyDeleteI think 'Faith' rots this part of the brain.
So he's basically just taken every argument ever thrown at him; bundled them up into one, big congealed mess and launched them at an instructional video of a woman telling people not to put water on a chip pan fire?
Wow.
There must be something in the human brain that controls ones ability to formulate and recognize parodies/analogies/metaphors/abstract thought etc..
ReplyDeleteThe closest I've ever come to being able to explain it is to say that their minds lack subtlety. This is evidenced by their complete inability to understand irony, and by the fact that for the most part, their collective sense of humor is like that of a six-year-old.
And, yeah, you probably won't hear a peep from that quarter about this case, even from those who are appalled by it. They always put their wagons in a circle.
re: ignorant wacko asswipes in Oregon-
ReplyDeleteMedicine - ur doin it rong!
Is it just me, or does that female have the face of someone who gets beaten regularly, and the male the face of someone who regularly beats his wife?
Thanks Matt and Beam!
ReplyDeleteBeam, it's ok, I treat him well, just like they did the slaves in the Bible. ;)
He's using a woman with horrible facial scarring as as result of a grease fire as his latest tool to analogize hell? The term psychopath comes to mind.
ReplyDeleteShe has horrible facial scarring!
ReplyDeleteHoly shit, I thought it was bad before I knew that, but that just makes it so, so, so, so much worse!
His analogy would now only work if he died - went to Hell - and then was brought back to life with half his stupid mustache burnt off, the scent of sulfur in the air and a signed Polaroid of the Devil ass-raping Mother Teresa (atheist) in his shirt pocket.
Then he might have a case.
As it is, he's just a prick. A prick with a mustache.