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Friday, November 7, 2008

70 comments:

  1. euww cheesy.

    But cute.

    Let's hope that when those kids grow up they'll look at photos like that and say "and your point is...?"

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  2. how (sickeningly) cute.

    And you talk about 'fundie's indoctrinating their children.

    I still think we should set a date - 100 days, 6 months, 1 year - and reassess the work that Obama has done.

    BTW, have you notice how many poster have been popping up with his face? They remind me of the posters of Stalin and Mao.

    Maybe he'll start telling us that 'work makes us free' or he'll publish a book of his quotes that we can all carry around in our breast pocket.

    Just an observation.

    -laof (for now)

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  3. laof, that comment coupled with the Obama Youth one ...

    I think our enagement is over. I want my ring back.

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  4. Stew -

    You cad! <:-(

    Besides, don't you know? Etiquette states that I don't have to give the ring back.

    ;-)

    -laof

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  5. laof,

    "Maybe he'll start telling us that 'work makes us free'"

    Is that any different to Bush telling the American people to go shopping after 9/11?

    I'm all for recognizing the danger of putting the man on a pedestal and expecting him to solve all the world's problems - but I don't think that many people are actually doing that.

    In fact, it's only his detractors who claim that he's promising miracles; most of his supporters are aware of the challenges ahead.

    Just my opinion.

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  6. laof said...

    And you talk about 'fundie's indoctrinating their children.

    I know, one kid sharing his sign with another kid. What's the world coming to?

    loaf, what are you afraid of? You're going to get a tax cut? Maybe you make over 250 large and you'll have to pay 3.5% more on your income over 250,000.You might not be spied on without judicial oversight? Torture will no longer be policy? We'll start investing in infrastructure and education and not privatizing everything including our wars for profiteering corporatists? We'll move toward energy independence by creating incentives for cleaner alternative energy that will create jobs while addressing climate change? We might regain respect around the world?

    I could go on and on. I don't think Obama will fix all of our problems but he will move our country in a direction towards fixing them. Bush and the Repubs fucked us so bad, it will take years to turn around.

    What is it you're so frightened will happen?

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  7. Yeah, maybe he'll pull of his rubber mask and reveal himself as the reptilian overlord, laughing at McCain for calling him a Messiah in an attack ad. Then he'll fly out the window and burn a flag on top of the Capitol building, and shoot everyone who doesn't kneel before him with laser beams out of his eyes.

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  8. Craig said:

    "loaf, what are you afraid of? You're going to get a tax cut? Maybe you make over 250 large and you'll have to pay 3.5% more on your income over 250,000."

    Are we SURE that it's $250k? Seems that the amount was changing. Even Obama's last statement was $200K. And that's combined for a family.

    THAT'S what I'm talking about. Let's see how much the figures change.

    And... whether I'm making over that amount or what - isn't that the American dream? Why should I pay a higher percentage than someone earning less than me? Because I'm successful?

    Take a look at this and learn:

    http://www.wisebread.com/bar-stool-economics-0

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  9. expatmatt said:

    "I'm all for recognizing the danger of putting the man on a pedestal and expecting him to solve all the world's problems - but I don't think that many people are actually doing that. "

    EPM - I would expect him to do his best to keep 1/2 or more of the things he promised, such as:

    - Fix the economic 'crisis' (without bailing out everybody and their mother to do it)

    - Institute a fair tax scale - don't penalize someone over $250k just because they've been successful. And don't expect businesses to stay in the U.S. if you make it a tax hell.

    - War - let's bring those boys home! Oh, wait - now that you're elected, you say it can't be within the 16 months you promised? So will it be your first term, Mr. Obama, or may it take two terms now?
    Also - how long is that hunt for bin Laden going to take, now that you have that promise to live up to?

    - Energy - let's not expect that any alternate source of energy is going to be successful if it needs gov't. subsidies to survive. Ethanol is a joke - it's too expensive to produce, it's less efficient than gasoline and - surprise! - it is just a polluting (if not more) than some of the cleaner-burning fuels (diesel, gas, coal).

    - Let's NOT keep the promise to 'bankrupt' the coal industry. Why eliminate jobs AND one of our own domestic sources of energy in one stroke? And forget cap-and-trade until we have those alternate sources.
    And let's just keep that moratorium on drilling suspended for now... drill here (US), drill now, until you have a better idea that's not going to take 10 years to become productive and affordable.

    Hold Obama accountable. That's all I'm saying. As the (pure) skeptic here, I see that he's already trying to create his wiggle-room and will soon be back-pedaling on these and other issues.

    I won't even go into the socialized healthcare issue.

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  10. Craig also said:

    " Bush and the Repubs fucked us so bad, it will take years to turn around."

    Yeah, and the Dems (Pelosi and Reid) have fixed so much in the two years they've been in power.

    "What is it you're so frightened will happen?"

    I'm not frightened of anything. I just see the same things coming that you so easily blame on previous administrations...

    Wait - blaming on previous administrations - that only works for Dem. presidents, right?

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  11. and expatmatt said:

    "In fact, it's only his detractors who claim that he's promising miracles; most of his supporters are aware of the challenges ahead."

    Well, every president faces challenges.

    Unlike others, Obama comes into the White House with a Senate AND House controlled by his party. He has no reason (or excuse) to not accomplish anything he sets his mind to.

    Of course, the excuse that it 'can't be accomplished in his first term' only helps his chances of being re-elected, right?

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  12. I wasn't talking about Obama, I was talking about racism.

    It's too bad that your hatred of one man and the equality that he may represent to some skews your judgment to the point that you can't appreciate a nice idea, loaf.

    You're so bitter, and it's so sad.

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  13. Living as one freed:

    You mean something like this?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fxdt_f0hwUg

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  14. "he'll publish a book of his quotes that we can all carry around in our breast pocket."

    Just like this?
    http://tinyurl.com/5covbg

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  15. Maragon said:

    "t's too bad that your hatred of one man and the equality that he may represent to some skews your judgment to the point that you can't appreciate a nice idea, loaf.

    You're so bitter, and it's so sad."

    Hatred? Bitterness?

    Where do you get this?

    I'm still waiting for someone to call me a racist - that seems to fit the mold of some people around here.

    See my original post. Can this man not be judged after he has spent an adequate time in the office? Is he to be given a 'pass' for any and all failed accomplishments?

    Forget the picture of the kids - I posted the 'how (sickeningly) cute' to elicit a response, that's all.

    Or is it that I can't hold a man to a standard?

    Better check yourself - your hypocrisy is showing.

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  16. Well, if you're discussing Obama's policy - then you're off topic and not discussing what the point of the original post was - racism and equality issues.

    "Hatred? Bitterness?"
    I get it from your constant rants against Obama in topics that don't have anything to do with his policy or performance.

    "Better check yourself - your hypocrisy is showing."

    Back that statement up - with anything. I'd love to see you try.

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  17. LAOF:

    George Bush had a Republican congress for six years.


    The South Park episode from Wednesday night was great. It perfectly illustrated the morons from both extremes. Those who think it's the end of the world, and more importantly, the US, and those who think Obama is going to piss liquid sunshine and shit daisies. He's just a man who is going to have to deal with the real world.

    No politician could keep all the promises they make, just like no politician could ever tell the truth and hope to get elected.

    The only important thing I see is that something happened that I didn't think I'd see in my lifetime. Twenty years ago people were going crazy about having one national holiday honoring just one black American.

    By the way; did anyone see the numbers on how black voters in California voted on Prop 8? Something like 70%? And about 53% of Latino voters backed it?

    Aren't human beings interesting?

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  18. Actually Maragon I may be wrong - he may have fullfilled the 'little book' requirement already:

    http://tinyurl.com/5rbrtw

    or

    http://tinyurl.com/58xzu6

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  19. "Actually Maragon I may be wrong - he may have fullfilled the 'little book' requirement already:

    http://tinyurl.com/5rbrtw

    or

    http://tinyurl.com/58xzu6"

    I'm not sure what you're trying to get at here. His books certainly aren't mandatory and trying to conflate him as a communist says far more about you than it does about him, loaf.

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  20. Maragon :

    "Back that statement up - with anything. I'd love to see you try."

    You have yet to back up your statements. Criticism isn't necessarily hatred.
    The bitternes of most people here was shown prior to the election whenever the polls favored McCain.

    Your saying something is so (or isn't so) isn't proof. You're not always right just because your party is in favor.

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  21. Among other things, laof said:

    "Of course, the excuse that it 'can't be accomplished in his first term' only helps his chances of being re-elected, right?"

    To be honest, I don't really care if he's re-elected. I'm British; we have our own problems to worry about!
    It does seem like you're getting a bit too panicked by the whole situation though.

    I'm interested by this also:

    "-laof (for now)"

    I always thought that your handle was a reference to some sort of freedom from sin you received from accepting Christ as your saviour, I didn't realize that your eternal salvation could be jeopardized by a changing of the guard in your nation's political infrastructure.

    Please correct me if I'm wrong here, as I no doubt am.
    :)

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  22. rufus:

    "George Bush had a Republican congress for six years. "

    Bush 2nd had a republican House for 6 years; the senate was republican for only 4 of his (now) 7 years.

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  23. "You have yet to back up your statements. Criticism isn't necessarily hatred. "

    What statements? I posted a PICTURE with no text. A picture about racism and equality issues. You took it upon yourself to go into an unnecessary diatribe about Obama, not me.

    "The bitternes of most people here was shown prior to the election whenever the polls favored McCain."

    McCain was fine, Palin was crazy.

    "Your saying something is so (or isn't so) isn't proof. "

    Right back at you.

    "You're not always right just because your party is in favor."

    Not my party. I am, thankfully, a Canadian citizen.

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  24. expatmatt:

    "I always thought that your handle was a reference to some sort of freedom from sin.." etc. (truncated for brevity).

    That isn't the first assumption made about me on this blog. No offence EPM, I don't blame you; just that assumptions here run rampant.

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  25. laof,
    "That isn't the first assumption made about me on this blog. No offence EPM, I don't blame you; just that assumptions here run rampant."

    Yes, and I requested that you correct me if I was mistaken and, in fact, anticipated that I wasn't correct in my assumption. What's the problem?

    Somehow you've taken it upon yourself to turn my humility around and use it to support a negative generalization against the group at large. And this comes very closely after you assumed, falsely, that Maragon was a Democrat.

    Humble pie for you, sir.

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  26. Wow, LAOF, you are correct, sir. And George Bush had such a tough time with Congress his first six years.

    You check out that clip from Jesus Camp?

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  27. laof said...

    Are we SURE that it's $250k? Seems that the amount was changing. Even Obama's last statement was $200K. And that's combined for a family.

    Yes, I'm SURE. Up to $150k you get a tax break. $150k to $250 your taxes stay the same. Your taxes go up 3.5% on every dollar OVER $250k. Those figures have not changed. It's the same rate on the top bracket as was passed in the 1993 budget when we heard all the same dire predictions about "punishing wealth".

    I read that barstool thing and it's a laughable caricature of the tax system. Income taxes aren't the only taxes paid. It says nothing about % of income vs. % of taxes paid by top bracket.

    We're $11 trillion in debt. Should we just hand the bill to our kids and grandkids?

    loaf:

    "And... whether I'm making over that amount or what - isn't that the American dream? Why should I pay a higher percentage than someone earning less than me? Because I'm successful?"

    Yes. There used to be a social contract in this country. People earning a lot of money realized they owed something to the public commons. They use socialized roads, fire dept., police, courts, etc. It was good business to pay people a living wage. It made for loyal employees able to raise families and contribute to the economic health of the country.

    Now we're told to be afraid if the wealthy are asked to pitch in they'll flee the country. What happened to Country First?

    loaf:

    "Yeah, and the Dems (Pelosi and Reid) have fixed so much in the two years they've been in power."

    The Senate set a record for fillibusters with 92. Previous record, 60.

    loaf:

    "Wait - blaming on previous administrations - that only works for Dem. presidents, right?"

    Two words; Clinton, Carter. It's a bi-partisan sport. But, there's no getting around the fact that Bush fucked things up, badly. He had a Repub congress for most of 6 years. He got everything he asked for.

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  28. EPM said:

    " And this comes very closely after you assumed, falsely, that Maragon was a Democrat."

    I would greatly appreciate if you would show where I stated that Maragon was a Democrat. Or, at the least, to show evidence of my assumption, please.

    We're arguing platforms (or at least candidates) here; She very much seems to be taking the Obama side, I'm taking the 'other' side.

    I get a charge out of my worthy opponent; however, I can only guess that I'm annoying her.

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  29. I will add. I will be the first to hold Obama accountable for his decisions.

    About your name. Doesn't it imply you're posing as someone freed? Hows about livingfreed if in fact you're freed. Just asking.

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  30. To correct that (before someone accuses me otherwise) - I get a charge out of my worthy opponents replies and retorts.

    I'm told she's an attractive woman* too but did not mean to allude to that in my post above.

    Hopefully that's as clear as Mississipi mud
    :-/

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  31. craig:

    "I will add. I will be the first to hold Obama accountable for his decisions."

    Thank you for stating that. I appreciate the 'company' in that respect.

    I come not to bury Caesar, but to.. no, wait,wrong speech.

    Listen - Barrack H. Obama is the president. Far be it from me to contest that. This election was very decisive and IMHO more fraud-less (less fraudulent? non-fraud-rampant?) than recent past elections.

    (To understand to that which I refer, just search 'Wisconsin Voter Fraud' on google.)

    The voters have spoken. If you don't feel an elected official should be held to standards, raise your hands.

    Otherwise, let's try a little reform here... no matter who is which party.

    "Can't we all just get along?"

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  32. rufus said:

    "You check out that clip from Jesus Camp?"

    no, don't intend to. Should I?

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  33. and EPM - I'll let you judge...

    Did I break my snarky comment hiatus already?

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  34. laof said...

    "Can't we all just get along?"

    YES WE CAN!

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  35. LAOF:

    You're the asshole (yes, I said asshole, I meant asshole) making these statements:

    "And you talk about 'fundie's indoctrinating their children."

    "BTW, have you notice how many poster have been popping up with his face? They remind me of the posters of Stalin and Mao.

    Maybe he'll start telling us that 'work makes us free' or he'll publish a book of his quotes that we can all carry around in our breast pocket."

    "'Make those babies as love offerings for the Messiah.... increase the numbers... then in his 3rd term they can enter the Obama Youth, for the betterment of the Fatherland...'"


    Like I said, asshole. And I mean asshole.

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  36. rufus said:

    "You're the asshole (yes, I said asshole, I meant asshole) making these statements:"

    Hey, that's your opinion. You've the right to it. Same as I have the right to express mine as well.

    I'm pretty certain others here agree with you.

    Have a good weekend.

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  37. Yeah, you're making those kinds of statements about Obama, then you won't watch a 90 second clip of some real creepy shit. Why? Because it concerned Bush? It concerned Jesus? because you don't think it's creepy if concerns Bush and/or Jesus?

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  38. rufus said:

    "Yeah, you're making those kinds of statements about Obama, then you won't watch a 90 second clip of some real creepy shit. Why? Because it concerned Bush? It concerned Jesus? because you don't think it's creepy if concerns Bush and/or Jesus?"

    No, I don't know what it's about. I didn't watch it and I didn't see any description of what it contained.

    So, are you going to bug me till I watch it? Or do I have to justify my choice not to?

    (1.Not that you bugging me would affect my freedom of choice and

    2.Not that I have to justify my choice to anyone.)

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  39. LAOF:

    No, but you've proven my point. Thanks.

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  40. Rufus -

    And you've proven one I brought up a long time ago.

    Thanks to you as well.

    Have a good weekend.

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  41. LAOF:

    What point is that? That you're an asshole? ;-)

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  42. laof,

    This is where I thought you'd assumed Maragon's political affiliation;

    "The bitterness of most people here was shown prior to the election whenever the polls favored McCain.

    Your saying something is so (or isn't so) isn't proof. You're not always right just because your party is in favor."

    The Democrats are now the party in favor and you're telling Maragon that something isn't so just because she says so (just because her party's in favor).

    Once again, if I'm wrong; tell me. My main point was that assumptions are inevitable when conversing via blog posting so it's nice when clarifications are made. For instance, your handle...?

    Also,

    "and EPM - I'll let you judge...

    Did I break my snarky comment hiatus already?"

    Not at all. You're one of the few that holds a strongly opposing worldview around here and we appreciate your input. Although 'how (sickeningly) cute' was borderline...

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  43. I'm glad Obama won, and I think McCain ran a fine campaign. I wish I could see what McCain would do as president, but at the same time, I'm really opposed to Sarah Palin as vice president.

    So congratulations to both McCain and Obama! I only wish the best for Palin, and even though the White House isn't in the cards, I hope she finds her place.

    Good job to everyone.

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  44. So even baby killers have cheesy cuteness.

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  45. OR should I say:

    So even people that vote in baby killers have cheesy cuteness.

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  46. Dan wrote...
    "So even baby killers..."

    I prefer to be called "infanticidal maniac" thank you very much.

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  47. infanticide, nice word!

    I stand corrected

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  48. "Barack Obama is our next president, which is very bad because he is a naive untested wealth-spreading terrorist-befriending ultraliberal socialist communist who will suddenly reveal his secret Muslim identity by riding to his inauguration on a camel shouting ''Death to Israel!'' (I mean Obama will be shouting this, not the camel) after which he will wreck the economy by sending Joe the Plumber to Guantánamo and taxing away all the income of anybody who makes over $137.50 per year and giving it to bloated government agencies that will deliberately set it on fire."
    --Dave Barry, The Miami Herald

    Full column here:

    http://www.miamiherald.com/living/columnists/dave-barry/story/756596.html

    -------------
    For nogod's sake, LAOF, go and read it. You need a laugh.

    And Dan needs to get his underwear starched.

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  49. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  50. Dave Barry with The Miami Herald gets the tee shirt award.

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  51. Come on Dan, as much as I was a typical liberal who disagreed with Bush, I still had far too much respect for the presidency and the democratic process to post stuff like, "Not MY president!"

    Although, you may be right in a sense. Obama isn't your president, he is our president. Love him or hate him, it's our duty as Americans now to make sure his presidency is as successful for this nation as it can be.

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  52. Since this blog doesn't deal with facts and not that it matters anyway, but I wanted to point out the "fact" that it was because of Dave Barry's comments that got him awarded that t-shirt and not that I agreed with him.

    I voted for someone that was in strong opposition to abortions, unlike the two most popular candidates. I voted for Bob Barr so you all actually should thank me for taking votes, that would of been for McCain, away from Him. I tried to convince people to do the same. So your welcome.

    Enjoy the time you have on earth since it won't be long now. BTW while you are at it, please repent and trust in Jesus.

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  53. Romans 13: 1-2, Dan. It's your book. Follow it.

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  54. Rufus,

    I love those verses 100%. Amen

    Was that verse for atheists?

    "and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation."

    I stopped resisting a long time ago. Now it's your turn. Great verse here is another:

    Joshua 24:15 "And if it seem evil unto you to serve the LORD, choose you this day whom ye will serve; whether the gods which your fathers served that were on the other side of the flood, or the gods of the Amorites, in whose land ye dwell: but as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD."

    Amen!

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  55. Yeah, Dan, turn to the Old Testament. Just another cherry picking Christian. Any other time we hear that's the Old Testament, the old covenant, that doesn't count. What a joke.

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  56. Dear Dan
    "Enjoy the time you have on earth since it won't be long now. BTW while you are at it, please repent and" submit to Allah.
    "I stopped resisting a long time ago. Now it's your turn."

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  57. (my last post was quotes from Dan changed to truth. They are his way of talking, I am not a jerk)

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  58. "BTW while you are at it, please repent and trust in Jesus."

    Don't tell me how to live my life especially when it involves me playing a role in your fixed fantasy.

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  59. Dan is a comedic mastermind. Brilliant deadpan delivery.

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  60. "Enjoy the time you have on earth since it won't be long now. "

    The sad part is, that even when you die(I so hope of old age)and you still haven't seen the rapture or any of the end times, you'll forget that you insisted they'd start happening like 40 years ago.

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  61. Dan,

    I don't suppose you read the rest of the Dave Barry column that I linked to. His next paragraph was about McCain and Palin.

    Or, John McCain is our next president, which is very bad because he is a 287-year-old out-of-touch multiple-house-owning fascist who will rape the environment and build nuclear power plants inside elementary schools and reinstate slavery and create tax loopholes that benefit only people who own three or more personal helicopters, after which he will declare war on the entire United Nations and then keel over dead and leave us with commander-in-chief Sarah ''Flash Card'' Palin.

    Or, Ralph Nader is our next president, which is very bad because it means there has been a successful Klingon invasion.

    Or, the outcome of the election is being disputed because of irregularities such as unregistered horses voting in Ohio, or some Florida county tabulating votes in Roman numerals, or God knows what else, which is very bad because it means the next president will be selected via a giant Lawyer-Palooza court fight that will go on until it's time to hold the Iowa caucuses for the NEXT presidential election.

    So basically my analysis is that, whatever happened, we are, as a nation, doomed. We are also bitterly divided, because whoever wins, roughly half of us will despise the other half, and vice versa....

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  62. Weemaryanne,

    Thanks, and no I didn't take the time to read Mr. Barry's article.

    "So basically my analysis is that, whatever happened, we are, as a nation, doomed."

    I agree with you there but probably for different reasons though.

    "We are also bitterly divided, because whoever wins, roughly half of us will despise the other half, and vice versa...."

    OK, that's where we disagree. Yes I am very upset that you would actually condone abortions, for example, but I still love you enough to try to help get you saved from God's wrath. I understand that I may be hated but as for myself I do not hate any of you. I would love an epiphany moment from all of you that God truly does exist and we all will see his righteousness and justice very soon.

    But this bitter divide could of been solved if everyone of us voted third party and took out all the incumbents and started fresh. I am disappointed at all of us but it was perfectly expected. Ron Paul would of solved many issues on the liberal side and the conservative side but America wasn't truly ready for positive change but just change. So we made our bed so we all "together" will sleep in it.

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  63. livingasonefreed said...
    Hold Obama accountable. That's all I'm saying. As the (pure) skeptic here, I see that he's already trying to create his wiggle-room and will soon be back-pedaling on these and other issues.

    As the (pure) skeptic here

    Wait... What?

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  64. weemaryanne -

    Hey, thanks for the link. I've read DB for ages and love his writing.

    I especially liked the line:

    "But also they were capable of understanding a concept that we seem to have lost, which is that people who disagree with you politically are not necessarily evil or stupid"

    I've always tried to treat people with respect no matter who they vote for. If I've actually called anyone evil or stupid because they voted for Obama, please provide the exact source and I'll apologize for it.

    I, on the other hand, have to put up with some name calling just for voicing my opinions.

    (cue the cries of 'persecution complex0

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  65. Mr. Smith -

    Which part did you not understand - 'pure' or 'skeptic'?

    Or, was it how that applies to me personally?

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  66. EPM -

    Thanks (see your post).

    Although I don't consider'how (sickeningly) cute' any worse than 'euww cheesy' (no offence to Stew).

    I think kids are cute (love 'em, and I don't mean in the 'baby-eating-atheist-stereotype' way either) but either party seems to draw them into the election/political process whenever they think it best suits thier needs. The old 'politician kissing the baby' gag.

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  67. Rufus wrote He's just a man who is going to have to deal with the real world.

    I think this is why I voted for him: all things being equal, I think he's more capable than McCain is. Ron Paul too (tho I admit liking much of what he spoke about).

    About the picture - I know it was cute and all, but the first thing I felt when seeing it was "Wow, cool.."

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  68. The sad part is, that even when you die(I so hope of old age)and you still haven't seen the rapture or any of the end times, you'll forget that you insisted they'd start happening like 40 years ago.

    ZOMG Maragon's a mystic prescient atheist soothsayer!

    /grovel




    PS. you nailed that one to the wall

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